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[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles." ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\nLolll no, not at all in the modern era" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\nLolll no, not at all in the modern era", ">\n\n?? There’s plenty of shts out there still-look at Steve Bannon, MAGA, Roger Stone, Proud Boys etc" ]

[ "Their adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nWhy is being any other than white American is a cult?", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nwhite*", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nfr", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nThat describes almost literally every single human being. I don't know a single adult who's current identity isn't strongly shaped by their childhood.", ">\n\nof course, I’m talking about extremes tho. Read my comment up above", ">\n\nIt sounds more like you're only talking about the people who grow up to be something you dislike. Everyone is shaped strongly by their childhoods. Some people grow up to be cultish devotees because of their childhood, some grow up to strongly oppose the things they witnessed during their childhood.", ">\n\nThis comment reminds me of a LOT of ex-evangelicals on TikTok, they tend to be a perfect example of the latter group.", ">\n\n… most of the time the main reason why people stay in cults after being raised in them is because they’re VICTIMS. There’s much abuse and manipulation that happens during the children years if you grow up in a cult. Sure they “want” to stay, but that’s only because of the abuse and manipulation they endured as children and they don’t really feel like they have any other choice.", ">\n\nAdvocate of the devil: maybe not all cults are bad?. We only call social group cults when they differ and separate from popular opinion to a certain degree. I imagine there are a bunch of people living in a wholesome community right now.\nThe assumption that cults are inherently associated with abuse and manipulation could also be seen as propoganda and biased media. I imagine you don't hear about the good ones until something goes bad.", ">\n\nI think I agree with this. Pretty much completely. Not as a condemnation of any demographic of people who strongly takes pride in their own nationality, but simply as proof that most humans are highly susceptible to cultish behavior, especially when it's something they learn from their parents.\nIt really all comes down to what kind of things you were exposed to as a child, and how you reacted to them. Sometimes you get people who strongly form their identities based specifically on the opposite of what their parents were trying to indoctrinate them with.", ">\n\nIt’s inherent in our nature to want to belong. If our group all believes one thing, we are more likely to believe it. Its gives us a group identity. As long as you stay within the group, you’ll always have that support system. I think it probably evolutionary feature that the species. It applies to all groups though and not just ancestry(ie. Political party, citizenship)\nI understand what you are saying though, some people take it too far. That happens with everything though.", ">\n\nwould it not be better for those groups to be created by shared ideals or experiances, rather than shared appearances?", ">\n\nAppearances? Nationality = appearance to you?", ">\n\nThe idea of placing maximum emphasis on human individuality is a popular, modern social construct. We crave individuality but we are ultimately all part of a larger group. The benefit to that is that it provided a larger social safety net and assisted humans in their survival. \nCulture grounds us.\nWhy are people so intent to stand out as different? Is it because we as a generation are particularly intelligent or enlightened? Not really. I think any of us born 200 years ago would have acted like like people 200 years ago. \nI think the idolization of individuality befote group benefits consumerism more than anything.", ">\n\nCan't throw the baby out with the bath water. Expansion of individual rights and the development of science are tied up in 'enlightenment ideals' of individualism over tradition. Humans by nature are inclined to identify by ingroups, like with anything it's a balance. One could hope we can make all humans our ingroup by rationality alone, but that's definitely not where we're at today", ">\n\nNot sure about the cult comparison but fanatism pisses me off no matter what part of life it is.\nSport fanatism, religious fanatism, nationalist or culural fanatism, or whatever else there is to be fanatic about. If youre as dead set on a topic it tells me you have either nothing else in your life to be proud of or youre simply narrow minded", ">\n\nAgreed. I get really annoyed by gender fanaticism. Specifically guys. I work in Construction and every time there’s a new hire and a little info about them it’s always the same hobbies; hunting, fishing, outdoors, trucks, ATV’s, etc. I’m always wondering if these people are really into all of that or are they just hell bend on doing “man” things. Obsessing with being a stereotypical “guy”.", ">\n\nThis is not an opinion- it’s a hypothesis and not a very good one. Any sociology 101 student could find the holes. People will strongly identify with a culture as long as it meet their social needs. A cult is about an idea or a person whereas any culture is far more than that, even our native language shapes how we think and see the world. Cults adopt superficial versions of a culture or religion but provide none of the social benefits. Saying people who are religious are likely prone to cultdom, fine. But the rest is drivel.", ">\n\na cult has culture. It’s not just ideas but a lifestyle", ">\n\nIt only serves the needs of the leaders at the expense of the followers. A culture evolved over centuries to meet the needs of a people for establishing norms around marriage, family, sport, faith, education, manhood, womanhood. Cults are just about controlling a small group of people to benefit its leaders. It is a con.", ">\n\nno. Cults serve their followers needs as well. Or cults wouldn’t exist", ">\n\nBeing the same color as someone, having the same tribes or nations of ancestry, or our mothers making the same kind of food at home don’t make me feel connected to them. I think that often it’s an easy way to belong to something. Something that requires 0 effort. I’m a quarter Ukrainian, and it’s hilarious to me how many other half or quarter, or 8th Ukrainians who live around me (in California) have screamed it to the world since that shit over there became big news. Social media posts, bumper stickers, and flying flags outside their house that they likely just bought a couple months ago on Amazon. \nMy cousin and I are 1/16th Native American. But reading her social media posts you would think she grew up on the reservation. She tries to convince me to learn the language when it would have zero practical use in my life.", ">\n\nЯкщо мову не розумієш і не говориш, то не українець. Все просто. Американець ти", ">\n\nCouple things I’d like to add. 1. It makes a lot of sense to be more attached to your ethnic or cultural identity if you’re part of minority group, for reasons that I think should be pretty obvious. 2. It’s not really a diss to say “these are the type of people who wouldn’t leave a cult if they grew up in one”… yeah most people WOULDNT. Almost all people, including you. We’re heavily formed by our upbringing. YOU have a cultural upbringing that I’m sure you still pretty much adhere to. Most people don’t convert religions, or fully integrate into very foreign cultures as adults for the same reason.", ">\n\nI escaped a cult bro. And almost have little to no culture identity", ">\n\nbut you strongly oppose cults...see how you were formed by your childhood?", ">\n\nEVERYBODY strongly opposes cults\nAnd I never said that people aren’t shaped by their childhood experiences. Of course they are. I’m talking about to an extreme degree tho", ">\n\nmaybe specify that in your post then bc it sounds like you mean literally everyone that feels connected to their culture", ">\n\nI think I understand what you mean and if so I agree. The people who's entire existence is their group identity. It's wonderful to be proud of your heritage, but you didn't choose that. I'd rather know people as individuals.", ">\n\nexactly", ">\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something. \nAnd TBF, I’ve heard interviews with people who help ex-cult members and to hear them describe the process, anyone could fall victim to it if they aren’t diligent and aware.", ">\n\n\nI mean, the word “extreme” almost always denotes an unhealthy degree of something.\n\nAgree with this, if you're from Boston and you have no other personality other than being able to talk about being from Boston, how awesome Boston is, etc this would obviously be a bit annoying and it might benefit that person to explore other areas of interest. However, other than maybe annoying OP I'm kind of confused about the point being made.\nAlso agreed on your second point, it is possible to be in a cult without even knowing it.", ">\n\nSo when someone is overly obsessed with their identity group there's actually a literary term for people like that One dimensional characters\nYour identity group is not a personality and attempting to make it into one just makes you boring", ">\n\nFinally someone gets it", ">\n\nI was always told you should honor and respect your heritage. I don't go super traditional Swedish, but I know where my family comes from", ">\n\nI understand what you mean and I agree. I’m Puerto Rican and I see other Puerto Ricans are obsessed with the fact that they are Puerto Rican and with doing things the Puerto Rican way. Don’t get me wrong, I like being Puerto a Rican, I cook a lot of the foods for my children and my husband (who is not Puerto Rican-he is very White) and like to share things from my culture…but I also taught my kids how to use chopsticks and have served them Indian food. I live in Northern Maine on the Canadian border and tell them they must learn French before they learn Spanish, because they need French more (we have to regularly cross into New Brunswick or Quebec for shopping and errands as there is not much on the American side…also most people here speak both languages). I don’t identify myself by my culture. I identify myself by my faith and what I value, what I think, what I like…my ethnicity is only a small part of me.", ">\n\nI wonder if part of this is more recent “immigrants” (I know they’re a part of the US) being divorced from PR and missing their homeland. My manager is definitely a loud and proud Boricua because she moved from PR only a few years ago. She misses home but she can’t afford to go back", ">\n\nbeing too obsessed with oneself’s ethnicity also leads to prejudice towards other people", ">\n\nThis.", ">\n\nAnd how do you know these people treat their group identity as their primary?\nHave you had multiple irl conversations with these people or are you basing your perspective off of short social media interactions?\nWhat im saying is, if a black person decides to make a 30 sec post describing pride or need for unity after an event like the George Floyd shooting, do you determine that that is that persons who personality?\nHave you considered the amount of privilege it requires not have to think or worry about your group identity? \nThere are mass shootings that have targeted specific group identities, so shouldn’t it make sense that some people are incredibly aware of their group identity?\nAlso I know plenty of white irish or italian people that act like that, so why single out specifically racial minorities?", ">\n\nYeah this is obviously a “I don’t like people talking passionately about things they care about that I don’t care about” buried under a simple premise. That simple premise might be true to an extent… but probably not the real source of the complaint.", ">\n\nWhy does it bother you? lol do you get mad that some people have 2-3 American flags on their front lawn?", ">\n\nAnd maybe those ethnicities he mentions are trying to hold onto their culture despite pressure from those folks with 10 US flags waving from their trucks….", ">\n\n\nWhy do these people have to much pride in their culture?\n\nBecause they like and appreciate the culture that they born into and raised with \n\nWhy do they overly identify with it?\n\nIdk why don't you ask them \n\nThere’s so many cultures and different types of people out there. \n\nAnd? \n\nTheir adult identities are strongly shaped by their childhood experiences\n\nYou have just described every adult on the planet\n\nThese are the same kinds of people who if their parents were Scientologists, they would grow up to be one to.\nIf their parents were Mormons, they would grow up to be one too.\n\nIt's almost like being raised in a specific cultural/religious background will generally cause you to pick up the customs and beliefs of that culture/religion\nMy friend has Muslim parents and I know this may be shocking...\nShe's Muslim", ">\n\nyour last paragraph is exactly my point. Generally, whatever you’re raised as is what you are. So I extrapolated that out to the extreme cases and it makes sense that they would have a WAY higher probability of being what their parents are. Even if it’s continuing in a cult", ">\n\nBy that logic you're pretty much just saying any person born into a cult would likely continue to live in a cult...\nYup totally an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nno I’m not saying ‘likely’. I’m saying super super likely. Meaning like a 99% rate", ">\n\nGot any proof of that\nAnd that's not an unpopular opinion when it basically amounts to \"people born in a specfic cultural background will live their life based on that specific cultural background\". \nAnd cult indoctrination is a well know and well researched social phenomenon that most people are generally/superficially aware of.\nTo be honest your whole post feels more like a rant than an unpopular opinion", ">\n\nIt brings a sense of community", ">\n\nHuh? How did you read the post and say this? Where did OP ever say that?", ">\n\nI guess they think that because every place on the planet has sort of a default culture and default traditions. \nDoes OP celebrate Christmas, or Easter, or thanksgiving? Is that bad? Is that overly obsessing with your American culture and roots?\nOur entire lives are shaped by our upbringing, the culture and values we were born into/with. When such culture is the default one in a particular place, then you don't see it as sticking out, but if you're an ethnic minority, it sticks out and then people come up with opinions like this. \nThat being said I doubt OP was trying to be prejudiced in any way.", ">\n\nI think the question should be: why does it bother you? Is it because you don’t have a culture to identify with? Are you jealous? Because personally, I think that people who identify with their culture after years upon years of having that right TAKEN from them, is a very beautiful thing. Poc, especially black people have been fighting for that right since forever, and they ARE still struggling with it. In a world where racism is still very real, don’t you think identifying and having PRIDE in your culture is important?", ">\n\nOps or mine? I’m confused, sorry. 😅", ">\n\nYou sound undercover prejudiced", ">\n\nNot that deep undercover.", ">\n\nI think I agree to an extent. Using my own upbringing, I moved to the US when I was younger from my country where I was born, I'm Hispanic. As a result, I was raised much more American than Hispanic and I lost my Spanish. A few years ago, I moved closer to a city with a much more diverse Hispanic community, and started running into situations where I felt I was 'less' Hispanic than I apparently needed to be. I would get comments like \"Oh you don't speak Spanish? Are you even Hispanic??\" Or \"You don't like bachata or Spanish music, what?? Your parents didn't do a good job\". It just seemed so stupid to me. What defines culture? Am I any less Hispanic because I wasn't raised in my country and follow the same stereotypes and mannerisms? I still eat the same food and recognize things about my culture, but I simply wasn't raised in it. I don't listen to bad bunny, I listen to metal/rock, I don't dance bachata, I don't have an accent etc. My parents also don't act like stereotypical Hispanics.\nI think in situations like that, people overly identify with their culture bc they expect everyone else to be the same. In reality, upbringings are more gray and complex.", ">\n\nExactly and people in the comments ofc are crying RAAACIIIST when OP is a Mexican and also I can say as someone who is a quarter Irish that there is this same kind of culture that tends to happen with Irish-Americans too, maybe not to the same extreme, but it's definitely there and is annoying and my dad plays up his Irish side so much and calls us \"Irish\" on St. Patrick's day and I was like me and my sister are only about a quarter (like if you add it up from my dad and mom's side) and he was no... really? Well I guess so.. huh. Idk why but yeah there are a lot of Americans still holding on to whatever Irish blood they have from like 100 years ago and it's like we have literally no connection to that country anymore and they don't even see any American, even if they are fully Irish in heritage as having anything to do with them (I read some post from an Irish perspective about this that was reccomended one time lol).", ">\n\nThis is such an odd and shallow take. Who cares if people would equally love a different culture if they had been raised in it? That’s as profound as asking a kid “why do you love your mom so much? If you had grown up with a different woman as your mother, you’d love her instead.” So what? That doesn’t and shouldn’t undermine the love you have for your mom, or the enjoyment you have being part of the particular culture you were raised in.", ">\n\nPeople that support being attached to your ethnic group often don't realize this kind of attachment leads to discrimination and racism", ">\n\nexactly. And they’re saying I’m prejudiced lol", ">\n\nYep, giving importance to such irrelevant things to the character of a person such as gender, ethnicity or sexuality will inevitably end up on discrimination", ">\n\nYou said a lot without actually saying very much.\nPeople identify with the chance circumstances they're born into? Of course they do. Is it a problem? Usually not. Does this make them any different to cult members? Nope. Cult members are fundamentally just humans doing what humans do. Find their tribe and finding meaning in their life.\nPeople are allowed to be proud of their country, their ethnicity, what have you. And people are also allowed to love other countries, cultures, and what have you. But if nobody identified with their culture, it were proud of their culture, then all our cultures would just slowly fade out and die as the world gets more modernized, global and interconnected. Frankly, that just sounds boring.", ">\n\nIn some cases, it's to prove their bonafides when in fact, they are white washed to the core. This happens a lot with Asian females.", ">\n\nCan I ask what your ethnicity is by any chance?\nI do agree with you to a certain extent but I’d like to know what perspective you are coming from. \nI believe people should see themselves (and others) as individuals first before they any ethnic, cultural or racial identity.\nHowever being in touch with your roots is not the same as being in a cult.", ">\n\nMexican", ">\n\nI see. I’m black and it annoys me when fellow black people celebrate other black peoples achievements. We say stuff like black excellence etc. We bask in each other’s glory, however when black person does something fucked up, then all of a sudden we’re individuals again. And that person is no reflection on the rest of us. \nYou can’t have it both ways. And we wonder why people assume the worst of is based on the actions of a few. Because we compartmentalise ourselves. If we saw ourselves as individuals first, people would follow in kind.", ">\n\nAll cultures do this… not just black people. I personally think it’s good to celebrate the achievements in your community. They worked really hard and deserve the recognition. And of course no one wants to be known for the bad actions of one person. Because a majority of people are not like that and it leads to discrimination. I’m sure Muslims don’t like being labeled “terrorists” just like black people don’t like being labeled “thugs” or Hispanics as “illegal immigrants”. It has a huge negative impact. Black excellence and black girl magic have a positive impact.", ">\n\nWell literally that's human nature. Why do people so strongly believe in their respective religions and decry all others? Cause they grew up arbitrarily believing the religion as their parents taught them", ">\n\nyea that’s basically my post", ">\n\nHonestly, I'm jealous of people who have cultural identity. I don't know anything about the black side of my family. I had no choice but to find myself separate from a cultural community, and it's lonely truthfully. Culture gives you a sense of who you are and where you come from. It's easy to look down on that when you're blessed with knowing about yourself generationally in my opinion...", ">\n\nIt sounds like someone's parents were overly opinionated and they grew up to be like that too. 😂🤷🏾", ">\n\nTBH this is mainly just americans.\nPeople, at least here in the Nordics, just don't give a fuck about it. Want to be an arab sheik or native american for Halloween? Go for it. We use common sense as \"it's a costume\" .. also might be because it's actually only children (0-12) that dress up for Halloween and Fastelavn (scandinavian pagan type halloween.) \nBut I do take pride in my nationality and cultural heritage. I'm prideful that I live in one of the countries that actively leads the way in welfare, social wellbeing, education and sustainability. A cultural heritage made by our ancestors.", ">\n\nAs someone who immigrated across Europe, I also find it cringe to see other immigrants identify strongly with their home culture and diaspora in the new country. The reason why I moved is literally that I don't like mine, and while I get not everyone has the same reasons, it sounds just sad to live somewhere where you don't feel at home (culturally). The US seems different, I know an Italian guy who finds it weird when someone with 1/4 or 1/8 Italian ancestry in the US considers himself/herself Italian.", ">\n\nWhy don’t you like your culture? Mostly people move for safety and finances, they are not cultural. All cultures are beautiful and make sense for the historical point they appeared.", ">\n\nIt's depressing, limited, authoritarian, racist, traditional, close-minded, judgemental, illiberal, unambitious, people are much more negative (every other national from my country living abroad notices this when they return). Even as a kid, I mocked the country and the patriotic BS.", ">\n\nThis opinion isn't unpopular, It is racist, tho.", ">\n\nhow?", ">\n\nYou look at other cultures like yours is default and theirs is weird. You define following your lifestyle as “normal”. But from their point of view their culture is default and yours is “exotic” and “stereotypical” and you completely miss this most likely because you are white American", ">\n\nHe's Mexican lol and he clearly hit a nerve with a lot of commentors but I got it. He's talking about the type of people who have no individual identity outside of their parent's culture and act like stereotypes in order to get validation. Saw a lot of that in high school where at lunch there was the only Asian table, only Black table, only Mexican table and they treat everyone else as \"others\".", ">\n\nWell I grew up JW and got out so I guess that doesnt apply to me. Lol.", ">\n\nand you’re also take pride in your culture? and obsess over it.\nLike if you’re Mexican always making Mexican jokes, following your stereotype, doing all the Mexican traditions that you were taught?\nThese are the types I’m talking about where someone’s culture is their personality", ">\n\nWhich traditions should they follow if they are Mexican? Yours? Why? Because you think you're default?", ">\n\nsounds like to op western ideologies and culture is the standard. anyone doing something else is a no no.", ">\n\nGo on tribal land an express that opinion.", ">\n\nyour point?", ">\n\nThey have a sense of pride that will not be broken. Be careful who you express that opinion to.", ">\n\nHow do you determine if someone is too deep into their culture?", ">\n\nIf they act to their stereotype in many different \nways. It’s like bro, where’s your individuality??\nTheir personality is simply their group identity.\nAnd since people would die before they lose their identity, this is why these people would not be able to escape a cult they grew up in.\nCause losing your identity is worse than death\nSo if they grew up in a cult, then that cult is their \npersonal identity. Same logic follows", ">\n\nThis is so intensely stupid on so many levels", ">\n\nthen explain", ">\n\nYou sound prejudiced, racist and overall insufferable. Your post history supports my theory. Go away.", ">\n\nI guess the requirements to be considered racist are pretty loose huh", ">\n\nPerson: •sneezes•\nAmericans: that's racist", ">\n\nI think I get the jist of what you’re saying… people reduce the whole entirety of who they are based on their culture and ethnicity and nothing else. So like, this person will make their whole day and life about that culture and nothing else. I had a friend like this that I’ve known for awhile and he would basically talk about how his culture was superior to everything and everyone else. Every time I would talk to him, 99% of the time, conversation would revolve around his culture because it’s basically the only thing he could talk about. I had to leave him behind because it really just got super annoying and unhealthy. I’m assuming OP is talking about a person like this?", ">\n\nyes. And if they grew up in another culture they would be as equally obsessed with it.\nbut it’s random asf.\nSo same applies to being raised in a certain religion or cult", ">\n\nIt’s because they don’t know much else tbh.. like I think I’ve read what a few people have said, childhood experiences shape who you become as an adult. The thing is as an adult, you have the free will to change who you are and see somethings not right with how you are. At that point, one might be too deep in to change or think there’s nothing wrong", ">\n\nyour last sentence is exactly my point. \nThey’d be too deep in the cult too", ">\n\nTranslation: I really don’t have a culture", ">\n\nMore likely: my culture is the default/what I see as being normal", ">\n\nno it’s not that. I dont have a culture identity", ">\n\nDo you celebrate birthdays, Chritmas, New year's, Easter, and Thanksgiving? \nDo you have pop singers you like listening to?\nThen yes there is a culture that you may not identify with, but you follow and sort of fit within. Every human has a culture and traditions they follow", ">\n\nno I don’t. My cult didn’t allow any of those celebrations \nBut I do listen to music tho", ">\n\nAs a Pacific Islander, I would agree to an extent. I personally don't take pride in my race, specifically because it was a factor of my life that was completely out of my control, so it doesn't make much sense to be proud of or be judged by something I didn't have any part in creating. Partaking in cult-like behavior solely for being of a particular race is rather odd.\nHowever, I would also disagree on the basis that people with different cultural backgrounds do have very unique and different experiences growing up in the world, especially in melting pot societies. Some cultures have harder times growing up in melting pot societies than others, and I think they should be proud of being able to find success and happiness, if they were able to. If people of a certain culture all have similar experiences with animosity or struggle for just being their race, found happiness, and wanted to proudly share their experiences with each other, I wouldn't be opposed to it.", ">\n\nThis is an rather popular opinion across Western society, both online and offline.", ">\n\nEveryone purposely misunderstood OP imo. He merely means to say that taking pride in ones nationality is absurd bcz one could be born in a entirely different place. It's too arbitrary to be of value", ">\n\nNo he just has a bad take. He’s likely not referring to their nationality, but ethnicity. The fact that you could have been born as something else is irrelevant, they weren’t. They were born Mexican, Black, Asian, etc. Everyone has traditions or cultural practices that they picked up from their family", ">\n\nYes but having an unreasonable attachment and grouping everything else as the \"other\" causes problems", ">\n\nThis is exactly what op is doing", ">\n\nOP doesn't take pride in his disattachement; he says those who are intensely attached to a certain worldview should think about it more", ">\n\nYou're talking about Americans. Which is 5% of the world. most people don't obsess about this stuff at all. They cheer their team at the world cup, but apart from that their nationality/race/culture/whatever is not something they reflect on.", ">\n\nYou think nationalism only exists in America?", ">\n\nNo, I think obsessing about identity is huge in America. Nationalism is world wide", ">\n\nCould you explain how someone like Marine Le Pen isn't obsessed with the concept of French national identity?", ">\n\nShe's a freak show. You don't meet individual french people who talk about it, french students who pontificste it and the French media doesn't obsess over it", ">\n\nBut it's one of the few things that are inherent and unchanging. Most things in life you are not born with and frequently change. Your ethnicity or cultural background is something that you are born with that never ever changes. I think that's the difference. With religion, you're not really born with it, you might be raised to be a part of it, but you can wake up one day and decide that you want to believe in something else. It's not a part of who you are. Whereas, culture/ethnicity is a part of who you are and you can never change it. The reason they feel so connected to their culture is because it's a part of them, and unchanging part of them.", ">\n\nEthnicities and cultures are ever-changing.", ">\n\nRight, but that's not what I was talking about. What I was talking about was how you cannot change your ethnicity. The ethnicity you are born as, you cannot change. If I'm born Italian I can't wake up one day and decide I'm going to be Brazilian. And that is why people feel so connected to their ethnic/cultural background, because it is something you are born with and something that you cannot change.", ">\n\nYou’re not wrong. Don’t let the bitch switch hippies tell you otherwise.", ">\n\nThis game of spot the white American was too easy.", ">\n\nwelp you lost then", ">\n\nBecause russians are trying to kill my culture for centuries. So many artists, poets, musicians were killed just for being Ukrainian and denying to erase their identity to be Russian. If that was not that important they wouldn’t prohibit my language, they wouldn’t kill us for speaking ukrainian. It’s my debt to my ancestors and current fighters to keep what they died for", ">\n\nNot at all what the post is saying", ">\n\nYou can add religion to that.", ">\n\nI guess this is an opinion. Certainly nothing factual about it.", ">\n\nI'll agree with you until you get to \"black culture\".\nThr African diaspora in the America's, Southeast Asia, and Europe is directly related to the slave trade. These are people who were forcibly removed from their cultures, and generated their own in a new environment.\nI knew I was of Irish and Scottish descent even before I took a DNA test. The majority of black people outside of Africa who aren't recent immigrants don't have that luxury until taking DNA tests to even show them what countries of Africa they may be from.\nColonialism and the slave trade let's \"black culture\" get a pass in this regards.", ">\n\nWhy only black “allowed” to have a culture? Despite being white my nation was also traded as slaves. As all the Slavs.", ">\n\n99% of the time white \"slaves\" were indentured servants, which is entirely different from being owned as a slave. Was there Europeans slaves to other Europeans at points in history? Yes. But not at all in comparison to the African slave trade.\nAnd you completely proved my point with stating your \"nation\", you know where you're from and it's culture, the majority of the African diaspora does not. You are not the same.", ">\n\nNot exactly. I’m talking about Arabic slave trade of Eastern Europeans on Western European markets. It’s “classic” slavery with castration, sex and labour exploitation, not serfdom. Actually it doesn’t matter, I deserve my culture to be cherished. It’s not an accident russians want to destroy it so badly killing our artists, stealing from museums, prohibiting language and burning our books", ">\n\nBut America is the only country in the world that matters /s", ">\n\nI agree with you. It's cringe.", ">\n\nI could get behind this if you were talking about religions and not just cultures", ">\n\n\"You believe what you know\"?\nJust as you might think they are ignorant, I believe I share the same view .. just directed towards you. Not that I'm right either, but what you're claiming is without clear examples, evidence or just plain coherence.", ">\n\nYeah if you have pride in your familial roots you're in a cult!\n/S", ">\n\nnever said that", ">\n\nFamilial roots are your culture, so you kinda did.", ">\n\nI’m using culture and cult as different words", ">\n\nBut heavily referring to the two as almost the same.\nThere's no issue with being connected with your cultures practices and beliefs. It doesn't mean that they have no individual personality, that's just absurd.", ">\n\nNo I never referred to them as the same meaning \nI’m using cult to mean a harmful religion", ">\n\nThis is called unpopular opinion you nonce not r/facts, have to give the downvote", ">\n\nIt baffles me how someone can claim they want only the best for our community and at the same time use speech like \"black view or you want to be white so bad.\"\nSorry that my skin color/race doesn't determine how I view every topic, but I was born black and no one can take that from me.\nAlso while I understand the importance of not forgetting what my ancestors went through in this country, I won't use that as an excuse to be biased against white people or use my race to get my way or an \"easy win\" in debates.", ">\n\nLast time I partook is another culture my house got cursed. Im stickingbto my own now.", ">\n\nI mean... Literally any sports fan is weirdly overzealous about a team from the area they grew up (usually) which is essentially arbitrary as they have no actual relative link to the sports team besides geography", ">\n\nThis isn't an unpopular opinion. It's just a really stupid one.", ">\n\nI'm a little annoyed and not surprised that the groups mentioned are all considered ethnic groups. \nLet's dead \"kiss me, I'm Irish\" too since we're at it. And Greeks that say, 'Oppa!' Every time something breaks. And all the \"French chic\" instagram accounts.", ">\n\nOp this is very stupid", ">\n\n\"Mexican, \"black\" and \"Asian\" are not cultures. They are sad over-commercialized remnants of what used to be culture when it originally arrived to the USA. The only culture US has is consumer culture.", ">\n\nYou sound like a hater. Leave people alone 😂 who are you to judge and say they shouldn't be proud of who they are. Think about it, they live in a western country but want little to do with the culture? does that not tell you something?", ">\n\nDo you know these people on a deep personal level? Or do you only recognize the steretype parts of their culture/personality so you don't see the rest\nOr do you dismiss their individuality just because they fit into a culture's stereotype even though they can have individuality within these stereotypes?", ">\n\nYeah, I don’t particularly care that much about my own culture. I don’t get the craze either.", ">\n\nI would argue that people should be proud of their heritage and identity to a degree. It’s about balance, no one should be ashamed of who they are but they also shouldn’t think that they’re better than other people.", ">\n\nI’d need to write a fucking PhD thesis to unpack this post lol. \nTl;dr, Im biracial and grew up in two separate and distinct ethnic cultures that have come together to become a part of my life. I stay connected to my family and my heritage which is awesome and I feel sad that you just weren’t fortunate enough to experience a healthy culture like I was. That isn’t your fault… but your situation does not apply to everyone. \n\nSo if *you’re super proud in your current ethnicity, just know that you would be super proud in whatever ethnicity/culture you were born to \n\nNope absolutely not. There are many cultures in which women have less than zero rights and I absolutely would not be proud to be a part of that culture and would likely leave and go no contact with any family or friends that stick to such sexist and backwards thinking \nAlso, current ethnicity? As if that could change in the future? Lol", ">\n\nyou prolly would", ">\n\nYou are so grossly misinformed it’s sad. I went to a safe haven college for all women, which attracted many international students from intolerant cultures who wanted to escape that sexist and misogynistic thinking. In that case, it really is like leaving a cult which you should be able to understand, since you claim to have done so yourself.", ">\n\nIt's for the sense of belonging. Communities are important to satisfy human social needs. Some people are only a part of one or two communities.\nEmphasizing the community aspect of cults IS how cults work, essentially on every level. They induct people by making them feel like they belong. They maintain compliance by telling people they hurt the group if they slip up or ask too many questions or talk to the wrong people. It's also similar to smaller scale abusive relationships, but I won't go into that.\nI think you're right but I think it's a basic human thing and not an unpopular opinion. I guess it might become unpopular where the sentiment is sort of hateful about it?", ">\n\nI grew up without a dad soooo naturally, I will have to leave my children and never see them again...\nSorry, I'm just following the \"proud of crap I had no input in\" trend.\nI see this crap as a bad thing, they will tell you it's to stop discrimination or something but it's causing more because now we are just our race, gender, disability, sexual preference and whatever other intersectionality bull they think makes them more important in the modern pity party of narcissistic political crap that hurts all the work we have done for equality of race, gender and sexual preference.\nTo anyone who doesn't like that i said this. This is fact, not opinion sooo don't add \"personal truth\" because it's not important if you feel only being valued on skin colour is good... It's not. That's why our ancestors gave equality of opportunity to all in our 1st world countries.", ">\n\nTell me you dont live in the balkans without telling me you dont live in the Balkans", ">\n\nThis is truly a shit opinion. Congratulations. Im pretty sure you yourself have based your opinion on stereotypes.", ">\n\nI’m starting to think I should’ve posted in r/facts instead", ">\n\nNationalities band together in spite of various oppressions outsiders wouldn’t understand and cults are usually held together by nothing other than paralyzing fear… these are not apt comparisons… you have a lot to unpack before making comparative articles.", ">\n\n\"Are the same people\" comments are always nonsense", ">\n\nYou mention Mexican, Black or Asian but not the most famous of all ethnicities to exhibit this type of behavior…Maybe yta?", ">\n\nLolll no, not at all in the modern era", ">\n\n?? There’s plenty of shts out there still-look at Steve Bannon, MAGA, Roger Stone, Proud Boys etc", ">\n\nLol so you are coming up with like a handful of people in all of the world's white population when ir's far more popular for white people to play up the 1/16th of whatever non-white ancestry they might have because everyone knows that not being white is the \"cool\" thing right now. That's why we have all these videos of white people taking dna tests and crying when they find out they are completely white or people taking tests and finding out they are part white." ]

[]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button." ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning." ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button." ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning." ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird" ]

[ "Another video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?", ">\n\n\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\n\nCan't read the rest due to don't-want-the-app complications", ">\n\nClick the expand article button under the one that tells you to get the app. You get the entire article if you click that button.", ">\n\nOh lol thanks\n\nAt least five people were killed and 13 others injured when a car accelerated through pedestrians at an intersection in the southern Chinese hub of Guangzhou on Wednesday evening, state media said.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nVideos circulating on social media and geolocated by CNN appeared to show the vehicle, a black SUV, plowing through pedestrians on two separate crossings in the four-way intersection in a busy, upmarket commercial district of the city of 19 million.\nAnother video, circulating online and cited by state media, appears to show the driver throwing handfuls of cash out of his vehicle after pulling to the side of the road.\nLocal authorities said police had “controlled” the driver, a 22-year-old man from Guangdong province, and further investigation was underway.\nThe incident occurred during rush hour at 5:25 p.m., when many scooters, cars and pedestrians could be seen on the road.\nPolice and medical staff were immediately dispatched, according to local authorities, which also confirmed the casualty numbers.\nAn eyewitness cited in a report from state-run China News Service said the vehicle plowed through pedestrians at the junction without stopping afterward.\nWhile the incident was reported by China’s official media, it was not among trending topics on the country’s heavily controlled social media platform Weibo on Thursday morning.", ">\n\nSelmon bhoi in China?", ">\n\nlmao wtf", ">\n\nWeird", ">\n\nThis happens a dozen times in China every day, where are the news?" ]

[]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....)." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages.", ">\n\nI don't think they do, most British people don't even care if they stay or not." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages.", ">\n\nI don't think they do, most British people don't even care if they stay or not.", ">\n\nThey are not even round like marbles should be..." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages.", ">\n\nI don't think they do, most British people don't even care if they stay or not.", ">\n\nThey are not even round like marbles should be...", ">\n\nHaha thanks for that" ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages.", ">\n\nI don't think they do, most British people don't even care if they stay or not.", ">\n\nThey are not even round like marbles should be...", ">\n\nHaha thanks for that", ">\n\nThis reminds me of this:\n“Why are the great pyramids in Egypt?”\nBecause they were too big to take back to England." ]

[ "Citing the ancient law of “no takesbacksees” Michelle then may have run away quickly, putting up two middle fingers yelling other obscenities.", ">\n\n\"neener-neerer-neener!\" 👉😝👈", ">\n\nCan we have our stuff back?\nNo, we're not done looking at it yet!!", ">\n\n\"British people don't go to the musuem. The museum is full of other people looking at their own stuff\"", ">\n\nAlong with the pyramids, Taj Mahal, Santas Workshop....\n... the great wall of China.... Uh! And Colloseum!", ">\n\nIt's just so convenient to have all the world's wonders in one convenient place... that we get to charge admittance fees to look at.", ">\n\nEntry to the British Museum is free.", ">\n\nWhile technically true, it’s probably the weakest pro-colonizer argument you could possibly make. Average museum fee for places that charge is, what, $10?\nBesides, it misses the main point that the museum is beneficial to the city it’s in. That’s true even if they don’t charge at the door.", ">\n\n“Technically true” <- you mean true right? Haha it’s not a technicality, entry to the museum is free", ">\n\nEnterance to the UK is not.", ">\n\nWhy is this downvoted? It’s true 🤨", ">\n\nMust have hit a sore spot with the Brexit crowd.", ">\n\n\"It would \"open the gateway to the question of the entire contents of our museums\", she said.\"\nSorry, \"we stolen so many things\" is not a good enough reason for keeping stolen property.", ">\n\nThere are looted things in the British museum, Elgin brought these from the Ottoman authorities of Athens at the time, they were cutting statues up and firing them for lime.", ">\n\nConsidering that Greece led a revolution against the occupying Ottomans doesn’t exactly help the narrative. \nWe didn’t steal it a different occupying force did and we just paid them for the effort", ">\n\nThe marbles were bought in 1798. The revolution occured in 1821.\nThe marbles belong in greece, but it is not a looting issue in this case, just a moral one. Also, Greece was part of the Ottoman empire for over 5 centuries (1299–1820s). That isn't a short period of time.", ">\n\nThe point is they were bought by an occupying force so the justification isn’t really that great- hyperbole because the ottomans weren’t this bad but it’s like buying something from Belgium they took from the Congo", ">\n\nOwnership isn't based on what is fair, it is based on enforceablility. To be clear: the marbles must go home, that is a moral case.", ">\n\nYou’re right in a way but when dealing with international politics sure no one can force the UK to give them back without doing an act of war… knowing this and saying can’t do anything who cares isn’t exactly a way to get people on your side. Especially now when there’s a big push for reconciliation for the lootings by colonial powers", ">\n\nYou have to separate loot from items purchased with consent. \"Loot and spoilation\" are obligatory parts of museum collection documents, (i.e. you have to return stuff). The problem with the British Museum (and the real nightmare: The Royal Collection) is that they have articles that overide this, which I think is very wrong.\nThen again, the Royal collection is exempt from loads of stuff, as part of the Royal household exemptions (like most employment law....).", ">\n\nBut that’s the thing it was looted (I know Elgin removed them) by the ottomans then sold to the British. For the country that was looted they don’t really give a shot that you paid for it", ">\n\nHere's the thing, the way historic ownership works is the Ottomans did own it. If you want to go down that rabbit hole, you will have to hand back vast tracks of land all over the world.", ">\n\nIs she planning to transport the Parthenon to the UK or just straight up conquer Greece?", ">\n\nRule Britannia begins to play", ">\n\nI can see this backfiring when Britain wants some deal with the EU. Greece will say 'fuck off'.", ">\n\nyeah, Greece blocked north macedonia for years over literally the name macedonia and the number of points on the star on their flag. the UK isn't getting anywhere near a favorable deal without giving the marbles back", ">\n\nLike the old joke:\n\"Why are the pyramids in Egypt?\"\n\"Because they were too heavy to take to the British Museum\"", ">\n\nHave you seen how the Egyptians treat the ancient antiquity artifacts in their care? It would have been better for the pyramids if the English had stolen them. \nDon't get me wrong, the British are absolutely unredeemable historical bastards, but Egyptian artifacts are better off in a British museum than literally rotting in a shitty and poorly kept Egyptian warehouse or in some Egyptian oligarchs personal collection. Egypt doesn't deserve the artifacts from ancient antiquity that it has, and the current military dictatorship is only getting worse. \nPity the Egyptian people, because they are thoroughly screwed.", ">\n\nYou’re getting downvoted but you’re 100% correct. I was shocked at how poorly treated and kept the artifacts are in Egyptian museums. The famous Egyptian museum in Cairo has most artifacts literally piled unlabeled in corners, or on flimsy wooden chairs out in the open. People walk up and touch them and shit and they don’t care.", ">\n\nwell it sure the fuck would, wouldn't it?", ">\n\nOne big thing I really feel is missing on the conversation is, ironically, the historical context as to how the statues got there. One has to realize that humanity didn't really care for historical artifacts that weren't of that persons religion until English and French nobles in the 1700-1800 began popularizing archeology and anthropology of other cultures or ancient civilizations with different religons, and these statues (or the Rosetta Stone) are a perfect example of that.\nOriginally, when the Earl of Elgian Thomas Bruce didn't intend on taking the statues (but rather make reproductions and paintings), but that changed when he saw the situation. Specifically, the Ottoman authorities in control of Greece used the Parthenon as a munitions store (that eventually exploded and caused damage to the statues) and then were planning on destroying the statues to turn them into lime mortar for construction.\nFrom there he purchased the statues (admittedly though means of questionable legality and ethics) from the Ottomans far higher than what they had valued it, which effectively saved the rest of the Parthenon and other Ancient Greek from being destroyed as the remaining artifacts were now too valuable to destroy.\nCountless of the other artifacts acquired by the British Museum have similar stories. Basically before that point, every civilization basically didn't care about artifacts that were from a religion other than their contemporary religion (Egypt didn't seriously excavate, preserve, or study pre-muslim sites and artifacts such as the Rosetta Stone until after figures such as Napoleon and Howard Carter promoted Egyptology) or when getting war loot, just generally scrapping it for materials to make something more current (such as the ottomans almost scrapping the marbles, or the Conquistadors smelting the Aztec artifacts they had acquired as ransom to ingots for shipping). Whatever your views on repatriation, do remember that countless artifacts and historical throughout the would have been destroyed or simply ignored if it wasn't for the historical impact institutions such as the British Museum had on appreciating humanity's past.", ">\n\nEven with the Rosetta stone it was taken from the French when The British defeated them in a campaign in Egypt (1800s), it was just a pretty cool looking rock back then but then became a valuable piece of history when it was deciphered by British archaeologists.", ">\n\nThe weird thing with the Rosetta Stone is that most of it's value comes from what was done with it, not what it did. There are other stones very similar to it that could have filled the same role, but it was the first to be deciphered and helped archeologists understand things in a whole new way. \nAs far as heritage, it's basically a rock with laws on it. Interesting, but not of major historical value(outside it's impact on archaeology) like a one of a kind sculpture or various other artifacts like things from the Parthenon that are actual, historically and culturally important things.", ">\n\nThat is actually pretty cool. Thank you.", ">\n\nYeah, there's a lot of virtually identical stele out there that could have done the exact same thing, many on display in Egypt and elsewhere. The only reason the Rosetta Stone matters historically is that it was the first one translated. \nIt's kind of like if you went to Canada and wrote a law on a wall in French, English, and a native language so everyone can understand it. Then a thousand years from now nobody knows French, they use it to decipher French. That's all the Rosetta Stone is, a law on a rock in three languages.", ">\n\nI don't think they do, most British people don't even care if they stay or not.", ">\n\nThey are not even round like marbles should be...", ">\n\nHaha thanks for that", ">\n\nThis reminds me of this:\n“Why are the great pyramids in Egypt?”\nBecause they were too big to take back to England.", ">\n\nShe's not wrong that it absolutely opens a can of worms.\nI'm not saying it's moral to keep them, but literally every museum in the world having to reassess and potentially return large chunks of the collections is huge.\nNevermind figuring out who you send them back to and if they're even equipped to care for them." ]